interesting perspective on shock collars - Beagle Forum : Our Beagle World Forums
Go Back   Beagle Forum : Our Beagle World Forums > Beagle World > Health and Welfare

OurBeagleWorld.com is the premier Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-23-2012, 11:41 AM   #1 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
brandypup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 2,270
Default interesting perspective on shock collars

On Shocking Our Dogs | Dog Star Daily

On Shocking Our Dogs

December 18th, 2011 by Trish King Just because we can….doesn’t mean we should

I want to eat. Actually, I need to eat in order to survive. However, eating has become a battleground between my need for sustenance and my desire to avoid pain. At each mouthful, I could taste food, or an electric shock could hit the side of my face like a hot, burning, lightning bolt, causing me to gasp and pull back. But, often it doesn’t, in which case, I can take the next bite. But do I want to take the next bite? Need and pain fight each other. The end result is that I eat very carefully, one bite of soft food gently following another. I don’t snack and, while I can’t say I don’t enjoy my food (it still tastes good!) it comes at a price that is difficult to pay. This, by the way, is what happens when you have Trigeminal Neuralgia, a fairly rare condition that was once called “the suicide disease.”

What does this have to do with dogs and dog training? A lot, as it turns out. Over the last decade or so, the use of shock collars (also called e-collars) has been on the rise. No longer the purview of hunters and professionals, their price has come down and the general public has been buying them…and using them. You see them on dogs being walked on sidewalks, on trails, and in dog parks. You see them on aggressive dogs and unruly dogs. They come with a page or a booklet of instructions (which a good many people probably don’t read), and that’s about it.

After my latest bout with TN, I am more even firmly against them than before.

Imagine you are a dog with a desire to sniff – you need to sniff, it’s in your nature. Sometimes, you can sniff, but other times, when you are on your way to an attractive bush, you are hit by a painful electrical jolt on your neck. You immediately stop in your tracks, and turn back to look at your trusted boss, who tells you that you are a “good dog” for coming back. You trot back to him, and go on your way. The next time you’d like a good sniff, you may think twice. Or not. It may take many repetitions for you to associate the shock with the sniff. Even so, you still have this need to sniff! Multiply this association by any number of behaviors, all natural, all not desired by humans, and all of which can be punished by unexpected, hot pain. Puling on leash, not coming when called, eating stuff on the ground, jumping on counters, you name it.

But what about the observation that when e-collars are used on dogs, the dogs still seem to be happy? They still want to be with their owner, their tails still wag, and they still like to run around and play. Doesn’t that prove that the collars are benign? Well, there are studies that show that cortisol levels rise with their use, but I have another observation as well. When you are hit by an electrical shock, it is finite. When it ends, it ends. You cannot remember the pain – you just remember that it was very painful – and you go about living your life as though you were pain-free. Which you are! This is very different from having chronic pain, during which you are always reminded that it hurts. I think chronic pain can make one more irritable, even aggressive. Electric shock pain, on the other hand, is acute, horrible, and then gone.

However, after a shock, many of your behaviors are tentative, as you explore the possibility that they will cause pain. In just the way that I am careful about talking, because I don’t know which movement of my mouth will cause pain (if you know how much I like to talk, you can imagine how punishing this is for me), a dog being taught to heel using a shock collar is afraid to go anywhere except where safety is proven – right beside the owner. When he is there, he is praised, and his tail wags.

There are a few videos on You Tube in which men put shock collars on themselves and then roll around laughing when the shock hits, and they fall sidewise. Maybe this is funny during the videoing, in a perverse sort of way, but what would happen if the shock collars were always on, and they could not predict when the pain would hit – when they took a swig of beer, or lit a cigarette, drove a car, or took a bite of food? Eventually, they would be afraid to do anything. They would be under control. But we don’t do that to people – we do it to dogs, our pets, because we can and they love us anyway.
__________________
Prevention is Kinder then Destruction. Spay and Neuter. BE EDUCATED. If you breed, breed RESPONSIBLY 8,109 homeless beagles on Petfinder right now. Why are their breeders not stepping up? http://www.wonderpuppy.net/1breeding.php
Research, All I can do is open new doors for you to explore. Act and buy responsibly, your choice is the future of the breed. http://www.learntobreed.com/

New Vaccine standards! Miss Bones 2002-2010
brandypup is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 01-23-2012, 12:36 PM   #3 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
brandypup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 2,270
Default



From the link- I tried positive trianing methods for hours with no success.

Yes if you want a dog to submit within a hour use a shock collar. You will only get out of it what you put into it.
Simply Shocking - Electronic dog fences

Dog Training Equipment - Whole Dog Journal Article

Analyzing Dog Behavior and Puppy Behavior - Whole Dog Journal Article

Dog Training Without Electric Shock Collars - Whole Dog Journal Article

The Canine Shock Collar Debate - Whole Dog Journal Article

Peaceable Paws

http://www.k9kindness.org/wp-content...ith-Shock1.pdf

__________________
Prevention is Kinder then Destruction. Spay and Neuter. BE EDUCATED. If you breed, breed RESPONSIBLY 8,109 homeless beagles on Petfinder right now. Why are their breeders not stepping up? http://www.wonderpuppy.net/1breeding.php
Research, All I can do is open new doors for you to explore. Act and buy responsibly, your choice is the future of the breed. http://www.learntobreed.com/

New Vaccine standards! Miss Bones 2002-2010
brandypup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2012, 10:16 PM   #4 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Lincoln, NE
Posts: 1
Default

Using the collar to set boundries is what we use ours for. Our beagles have a certain distance they are allowed to wander from us and then we call them to us. If they don't respond, then they get the negative feedback. If they come when called, they get a treat. We have to keep it all in perspective. I do not set my collars on #9 and zap them till they are laying over. It's a little jolt to get their attention and a reminder that I am calling them. It's a tool for training and should be used as such. That's all I have to say about that....
Foodgod1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2012, 05:14 AM   #5 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
brandypup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 2,270
Default

Florida Man Arrested For Torturing Little Girls With Dog Shock Collar
__________________
Prevention is Kinder then Destruction. Spay and Neuter. BE EDUCATED. If you breed, breed RESPONSIBLY 8,109 homeless beagles on Petfinder right now. Why are their breeders not stepping up? http://www.wonderpuppy.net/1breeding.php
Research, All I can do is open new doors for you to explore. Act and buy responsibly, your choice is the future of the breed. http://www.learntobreed.com/

New Vaccine standards! Miss Bones 2002-2010
brandypup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 03:13 PM   #6 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 135
Default

I live in Wales in the UK and they are banned here! But are available in England (I don't know about Scotland) - a friend (who lives in England) has a cocker spaniel and his trainer advised the electric collar and he uses it a lot (I think to make the dog come back). My trainer said that if you use a collar you have to get the timing perfectly right (I suspect a lot of dog owners never get the perfect timing). I use a whistle and treats and with Poppy being a Beagle I don't have 100% recall probably never will she comes when she is ready - typical Beagle!!!!

I don't know what I think about the collars.

I spent 45 minutes running after Poppy while she was chasing sheep over a year ago. It was the worst 45 minutes of my life my children were crying thinking the farmer was going to come and shoot her. At one point I thought if he does come I will shoot her myself! She was dreadful would not listen to me all she wanted to do was chase/play with the sheep. Luckily I got hold of her, then enrolled in a class and spent a weekend with her training her not to chase sheep - I don't if it worked as she has not had the chance to chase any sheep since (and hopefully never will). I did think if she had an electric collar on when she was in the field I could have pressed it and stopped her in her tracks.
Vikki is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 04:53 PM   #7 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 896
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vikki View Post
I live in Wales in the UK and they are banned here! But are available in England (I don't know about Scotland) - a friend (who lives in England) has a cocker spaniel and his trainer advised the electric collar and he uses it a lot (I think to make the dog come back). My trainer said that if you use a collar you have to get the timing perfectly right (I suspect a lot of dog owners never get the perfect timing). I use a whistle and treats and with Poppy being a Beagle I don't have 100% recall probably never will she comes when she is ready - typical Beagle!!!!

I don't know what I think about the collars.

I spent 45 minutes running after Poppy while she was chasing sheep over a year ago. It was the worst 45 minutes of my life my children were crying thinking the farmer was going to come and shoot her. At one point I thought if he does come I will shoot her myself! She was dreadful would not listen to me all she wanted to do was chase/play with the sheep. Luckily I got hold of her, then enrolled in a class and spent a weekend with her training her not to chase sheep - I don't if it worked as she has not had the chance to chase any sheep since (and hopefully never will). I did think if she had an electric collar on when she was in the field I could have pressed it and stopped her in her tracks.

My Feist X jumped 4 fences in about 2 minutes a month ago. And when she gets loose she will NOT allow you to catch her. Like you, I wanted to kill her myself in the 45 minutes it took me to get her! She only weighs 16 pounds, though, and has a delicate, kind of Italian Greyhound/ Whippet body style. But my daughter used a shock collar on her 8 year old Doberman when he was a puppy, until they could get him trained, and it worked quite well. They were living in a house then, but have been in an apartment for over 2 years, and my son-in-law can potty him off leash.
Dawna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2013, 02:00 PM   #8 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 5
Default

I have a shock collar system similar to an electric fence (so not for training, but for keeping the dogs in the yard). There is a base plugged in inside the house, with many settings on it (controlling the radius and level of shock). The collars go on the dogs, and when they are at the radius the collar beeps, and if they continue it will shock them. 99% of the time they do not get shocked because of the warning beep. And since the radius is kept the same all the time, they just know where they can and cannot go. I am convinced our younger beagle who has been trained on this system since he was 6 months old has only been shocked the first day he was on it (there's really no other way to teach them what the beep means). This system is FANTASTIC! It lets the dogs run around all day long when we are at work, they are healthy and fit dogs all year long, and they are so happy all the time. I had seen so many hunting dogs just tied up all year long except for 2 weeks at hunting season and it really bothers me. Although my two beagles are primarily hunting dogs, they are treated well all the time and as long as this system is used properly I think it's a fabulous tool that all dog owners of high energy dogs should have.
Alyssa18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2013, 11:45 PM   #9 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3
Default

yes,the shock collar works well,but it do have its pro and cons.Shock collars may develop hostility behaviors in dogs.you can read this article here:Should You Use A Shock Collar To Train Your Dog?
__________________
Dog shock coallr and Wireless dog Fence is not be the whole solution for traning your dog's behaviors.
Dimitre is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:31 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.3.2
PetGuide.com
Basset.net DobermanTalk.com GoldenRetrieverForum.com OurBeagleWorld.com
BoxerForums.com DogForums.com GoPitbull.com PoodleForum.com
BulldogBreeds.com FishForums.com HavaneseForum.com SpoiledMaltese.com
CatForum.com GermanShepherds.com Labradoodle-dogs.net YorkieForum.com
Chihuahua-People.com RetrieverBreeds.com